Shloka 23
Śrī–Indra–Bali Saṃvāda: The Departure and Fourfold Placement of Lakṣmī
दृश्यमाने विनाशे च प्रत्यक्षे लोकसाक्षिके । आगमात् परमस्तीति ब्रुवन्नपि पराजित:,कुछ नास्तिक ऐसा कहा करते हैं कि देहरूपी आत्माका विनाश प्रत्यक्ष देखा जा रहा है। सम्पूर्ण लोक इसका साक्षी है। फिर भी यदि कोई शास्त्रप्रमाणकी ओट लेकर देहसे भिन्न आत्माकी सत्ताका प्रतिपादन करता है तो वह परास्त है; क्योंकि उसका कथन लोकानुभवके विरुद्ध है
dṛśyamāne vināśe ca pratyakṣe lokasākṣike | āgamāt paramastīti bruvann api parājitaḥ ||
Bhishma dijo: «Cuando la destrucción se ve directamente y el mundo entero da testimonio de ello, el escéptico considera derrotado a quien todavía sostiene—amparándose en la autoridad de las Escrituras—que existe una realidad suprema (o un yo) más allá de lo evidente, pues su afirmación parece ir contra la experiencia común».
भीष्म उवाच
Educational Q&A
The verse frames a classic epistemic conflict: skeptics privilege direct perception (pratyakṣa) and public experience (loka-sākṣika), and therefore claim victory over anyone who argues for a reality beyond the body on the basis of scripture (āgama). Bhīṣma is highlighting how arguments for the ātman or a ‘supreme’ principle can be challenged when they appear to contradict common observation.
In Śānti Parva’s post-war instruction, Bhīṣma discusses dharma and philosophical viewpoints. Here he articulates how a nāstika (skeptical/denialist) would argue: since bodily death is directly seen and universally witnessed, scriptural claims of a distinct self beyond the body are dismissed as losing against worldly experience.